wages, raises and keeping your job

[el capitan]

M'kay...just going to preface this post by saying that I am thankful I have a job with good people, in a field that I want to be in and with corporate ethics that I buy in to 100% ....that being said - I am being seriously underpaid and IMO seriously undervalued. An equivalent job in both the public and private sector pays anywhere from 5-12 dollars more an hour than what I am currently making...

To top it off my firm is having money problems and they have asked everyone to take 4 day weeks etc...to try and make it fiscally possible to make it through the summer (which is notoriously slow in the type of work we do) I haven't reduced my work time cause I can't afford it with my wage...my rent is equal to one of my paycheques... And vancouver is super expensive. I like the job, my coworkers and most of the work that I do but I need more money. I was going to ask for a raise the same week our poor financial health was revealed...just my fucking luck...

What should I do?
How much value should I place on a good working environment over cash money?
When will it be ok to ask for a raise?

Gah, being a bike courier was so much easier in a way...never had any of these problems...I was just always brole.. ;)

[lexicon]

Well, do you think you'd actually have anything to lose by asking for the raise?

Also, how soon are you thinking of jumping ship to a company in T.O. after paying your dues?

[tanowicki]

Could you ask for a raise so that you can afford to work the 4-day work week? Because then maybe they won't notice after the crisis is over that they gave you a 20% pay raise.

I suck at asking for raises but I've gotten okay at asking for more money at the beginning during the original salary negotiation.

[Lepus]

I agree with Lex regarding what do you have to lose. However, maybe wait until the end of summer when it seems they won't be so financially strapped, that is assuming this is a temporary slow down. Have the numbers to back up your claims as well when you do talk to them.

How deep is this poor financial health? Of course you aren't totally going to know but what are your impressions? If it isn't a temporary slow down then maybe it is time to start shopping your resume around. You have some experience now.

As for the importance of a healthy work environment in relation to cash money, from the experience of friends, it doesn't matter what you're being paid, it can't make up for a shit work environment. I know someone who was making half a million and quit because the environment was toxic.

That said, you also need to eat.

[el capitan]

The financial crunch is temporary I think....consulting is hard that way cause you have to fight for all of your work...we had a rough patch in the spring of losing proposals and that meant we have less work for the summer - which is always slow due to municipal government slowdowns during the summer break...

I just dont want to come across as the jerk asking for a raise when others are volunteering to work less hours in order to keep the company afloat...

But I do make a shit wage (as far as my profession goes) - and my actual job duties far exceed the expected duties outlined when I was hired...I have been here for a year (Aug 1) and should have a staff review around that time...

There is also the part where we are a very middle and top heavy company in terms of hierarchy...If I ask for a promotion/raise there will be no one to do the "grunt" work that I do - but I am already doing work far beyond the scope of my job description (work that I should have been hired to do with my education level-but whatever, it was a recession) but there are people already in that position who dont have as much work as me (based on interests and specialties)...so its a bit of a tough spot for the bosses....

anyone have any tips on asking for a raise? tips to negotiating promotions etc...?

to top it all off my gf is moving from T.O. to vancouver in a month -- with no job lined up here....

kill me now.

[tanowicki]

Make a list of what you do now and a list of what was expected of you per your job offer to show how you exceed the original list. Get good information about what people doing your work are getting paid in the Vancouver area, both public and private. Schedule a meeting with your boss and explain you're making $X below what someone else with your similar responsibilities are getting paid. Use the higher of the public or private - aim high. If they say they're broke, explain that you're doing things A B and C more than you were hired to do and feel that the extra responsibilities are worth the extra monies. Don't accept the first value they throw out but haggle.

[food_geek]

In any negotiation, there is something called a BATNA - the Best Alternative to a Negotiated Agreement. In other words, at what point do you walk away from the table and say "no". Going into any negotiation you should have this firmly in your mind because it removes a lot of the stress and emotion associated with whether you should agree or not agree to whatever's being offered. It either matches or exceeds your BATNA or it doesn't.

So, in this situation, there are obvious intangibles. Money isn't everything and working for a company that you like and support with good co-workers is a pretty important feature of any job. But if you can't eat or can't make your rent, then a great work environment clearly isn;t going to cut it. Remove the emotion from the situation. Forget "fair" or "not fair"; "comparable" or "not comparable". There is only what you need. Figure out the point at which you are willing to potentially accept a less ideal work environment for more pay. And know that it may be less than ideal, but that for financial reasons you are willing to accept that. That way, in 6 months, when you you realize that the bosses are jerks at the new place, you will remember that you made the decision for good reasons and you won't beat yourself up for it.

People understand financial difficulties. Your bosses should certainly understand, especially under the current circumstances. Explain the situation to them, tell them you understand that it's a bad time. But, if you are serious then they need to understand that they will lose you to a competitor unless then pay up. Not MAY lose you, WILL lose you. No threats. And if the status quo is truly unacceptable, you will need to follow through. That's your BATNA.

[el capitan]

I need to bust out my old copy of "Getting to Yes" from my planning school conflict resolution and negotiation class ...they only taught us how to negotiate with developers and city officials and how to mediate a roomful of angry citizens - nothing about negotiating a wage increase in your first job...I should write a note to the instructor with that suggestion...

I think I might talk to the boss next week...my calendar is filling with work so Im not worried about my billability targets in the coming months...